The following changes are being update to test as of 3PM PST today (8/9/2013). The formula for runspeed has been changed to the following: Code: Movement Speed = SpeedFromPosture * VitalityOrMountModifier * BuffModifier Fixed a bug where snares and roots would not take effect instantly. Tightened up the death animation to be more responsive. Note: SpeedFomPosture is determined by whether the player character is walking or running. Walking is 1/3rd of normal run speed.
Buffed is with druid buff, 70% RS, 10% Mount Speed. (This is not working properly. From a quick look. It seems ground speed gets the 70%, and flying gets the 10%, where flying and ground should be 10%) It still needs some tweaking. The current test version is another drop in speed. TEST: Unbuffed (except gear): 149.8 Self Buffed: 220.3 Mounted unbuffed (ground): 301 Mounted buffed (ground): 370 Flying unbuffed: 526 Flying Buffed: 595 LIVE: Unbuffed (except gear): 198.92 Self Buffed: 230.42 Mounted unbuffed (ground): 350 Mounted buffed (ground): 385 Flying unbuffed: 575 Flying Buffed: 610
I should note, I do think the variation from unmounted through flying is good. Just that the overall base is a tad low somewhere. I'm not 100% sure how the buffs are all working, but.. 149.8 -> 220.3 isn't +70, nor is it x 1.7 Might be a stacking issue... Thought there is a vit increase as well. I'm not majorly QQ about run speed changes, just thought I'd toss out the observations I saw.
Sorry to inform you guys, but the test update hasn't happened yet. Ops is telling me that there's a problem patching it. I'll let you know as soon as possible. Gresteh: Mount + Barding + Horseshoe + Tacking = MountModifier
Thanks for the update, now it sounds more like it should be, with run speed buffs affecting the mounts. Just one question, the +run speed buff that comes with the griffon necklace is now considered a 15% increase or a flat 15 run speed? That distinction is important for mounted speed given that now mounted speed would be multiplied by your buffs. For unmounted speed is not relevant but for mounted speed it would mean that we get an extra 15% run speed rather than the 15 flat that the tooltip mentions.
I will first say that there are some important terminology to establish. Runspeed (mounted or not) can only be modified by a percentage. I'll admit, this is confusing for a player because the stat shown is not the actual stat that we use to determine your runspeed. What we show you is a percentage that is relative to normal runspeed. So if you are walking, then you're moving at 1.85 meters per second. If your vitality bonus is 1.5%, then you're moving at 1.87775 meters per second. Your mount tab will say that your runspeed is 33.83% because that tab literally just prints out whatever your current movement speed is when divided by 5.55 (the running meters per second). Just like this: Code: MountTabSpeedPercentage = CurrentMovementSpeed / NormalRunSpeed; So the question is not "Is this a flat modifier?". Runspeed is NEVER a flat modifier. The question is always "How does this stack from modifiers from other sources?" Here's the breakdown of that. Buffs stack additively with themselves, and multiplicatively with everything else. Vitality and Mount never stack together (mounting gets rid of vitality bonus). Because bard songs are not active when mounted, bard songs and mount speed will never be there at the same time--however, because bard songs are just buffs, they technically stack mutliplicatively with mount speed. The runspeed mod from the Griffon Watch Insignia is actually coming from an equipped buff, so it's just another buff--stacking additively with other buffs, and multiplying over vitality and mount speed. Edit - Ops is telling me that Test server is now online. Jump in.
That's much better. I was toting off how the changes were going to be an increase.. didn't know test didn't actually get the update. It wasn't making sense in my head, hence my first post. So here's the refined stats: RS mod: 70% & 10% mounted EE's: +20 From Tect neck, +1 KDQ bag, +15 KDQ bracer (my test char needs an update ) TEST: Unbuffed (except gear): 151.55 (even with the 10%, it won't beat current live speed) Self Buffed: 226.39 (would actually be higher than current live speed if I had the dragon bag I think) Mounted unbuffed (ground): 372.3 Mounted buffed (ground): 584.25 Flying unbuffed: 700.8 Flying Buffed: 1032 RS mod: 70% & 10% mounted EE's: +20 From Tect neck, +1 KDQ bag, +15 KDQ bracer, +10 Dragon Skin bag LIVE: Unbuffed (except gear): 198.92 Self Buffed: 230.42 Mounted unbuffed (ground): 350 Mounted buffed (ground): 385 Flying unbuffed: 575 Flying Buffed: 610 It still doesn't seem to split the mounted vs unmounted portions of the speed bonuses. You get the full RS bonus rather than the lesser one. It should either pick the mounted speed bonus, or just remove that portion from the buff.
Well.. it is ~ a 47% increase just from getting the buff alone. Taking into account that some speed buffs might not stack with the EE's.... I don't know.. something fishy is going on there.
Ok... Stripped off everything. The 75 Vit from the druid's level 55 buff is 1.5% My unbuffed speed is 113.59 That is: 100% (base) * 3.26% (Vit) *10% (Racial) = 113.586 We're good so far. Buffed (70% speed buff) is 188.57 That is 100% (base) * 4.76% (Vit) *( 10% (racial) + 70% (buff)= 188.568 Still good. Popping the mount. 320 Flight speed, 95 ground speed. No tack or horseshoes. Speed is 214.5 That should be 100% (base) * 95% (mount) * 10% racial = 214.5 Check! buffing: 351.00 This should only be a 10% increase according to my buffs. 100% (base) * 95% (mount) * (10% racial + 10% buff) = 234 100% (base) * 95% (mount) * (10% racial + 70% buff) = 351 Ding! Ok.. on to flying: 462 unbuffed And we have 100% (base) * 320% (flight) * 10% racial = 462 We're good! buffed: 756 Let's see: 100% (base) * 320% (flight) * (10% racial + 70% buff) = 756 So yeah.. that is the culprit... now just to find where the oddness is coming from.
Running the check mounted (alleviates Vit as a variable) Tact neck on (+20 stacks with everything) Hmm where to add it though? Unbuffed + tact neck = 253.5 (vs 214.5 w/o tact neck) 100% (base) * 95% (mount) * (10% racial+ 20% Tact neck) =253.5 Bingo.. We're cookin' with gas now! Adding KDQ bag (1% increase) = 255.45 100% (base) * 95% (mount) * (10% racial+ 20% Tact neck + 1% KDQ bag) =255.45 Hanging in there! KDQ cog (15% buff) = 284.7 100% (base) * 95% (mount) * (10% racial+ 20% Tact neck + 1% KDQ bag + 15% COG ) =284.7 All clear! Add in the player buff: 419.25 100% (base) * 95% (mount) * (10% racial+ 20% Tact neck + 1% KDQ bag + 15% COG +70% buff ) =421.2 100% (base) * 95% (mount) * (10% racial+ 20% Tact neck + 1% KDQ bag + 15% COG +70% buff )= 419.25 Check! Time to make the doughnuts! Add in in tack (+10 mount) 440.75 100% (base) * (95% (mount) + 10% tack) * (10% racial+ 20% Tact neck + 1% KDQ bag + 15% COG +70% buff )= 440.75 Okie dokie. Add in horseshoes (+50) 548.25 100% (base) * (95% (mount) + 10% tack + 50% HS) * (10% racial+ 20% Tact neck + 1% KDQ bag + 15% COG +70% buff )= 548.25 Nothing there. Hmmmm
This doesn't hold a candle to healing spells Dooders... That's where you separate the men from the boys. I think I have 7 pages of reverse engineering.. just to figure out that the whole system is beyond normal comprehension... and that mods don't mod vs player level, they mod vs ability level. What a world! what a world!
I pulled part of my previous post, as I accidentally left in my player buff.. and that doesn't help us here! Inc more.
Lets get vertical! 613.2 flight speed, no player buff 100% base * 320% * (10% racial+ 20% Tact neck + 1% KDQ bag + 15% COG ) = 609 Hmmmm So where is this problem? Add in barding and horseshoes (RS 700.8): 100% base * (320% + 10% +50% ) * ( 10% racial + 20% Tact neck + 1% KDQ bag + 15% COG) = 696 Let's try another way All EE's are now GONE! Flight speed unbuffed: 528 100% base * (320% + 10% +50% ) * ( 10% racial) = 528 Let's ramp back up! 100% *( 320% + 50% + 10%) * 10% = 528 100% * (320% + 50% + 10% ) * (10% + 15% +20% ) = Awwwwww 696 But wait!! Magically the KDQ bag now works! 100% * (320% + 50% + 10% ) * (10% + 15% +20% + 1% )= 700.8!!!!! Add in the player buff 100% *( 320% + 50% + 10% ) * (10% + 15% +20% + 70% + 1% )= 1036.8 Cha- CHING!! Odd how one little % can just mess it all up. And the mounted/ unmounted speed on buffs is a complete game changer in the values.
SpeedFromPosture is a flat number. Not a percentage. You can't add it with VitalityModifier or Mount Modifier, which is a percentage. It has to be multiplied. Code: Speed = 5.55 * (1.0 + 3.20 + 0.50 + 0.10 ) * (1.0 + 0.1 + 0.15 + 0.20 + 0.01 ) Speed = 5.55 * 4.8 * 1.46 Speed = 26.64 * 1.46 Speed = 38.8944 meters per second. MountTabPercentage = 38.8944 / 5.55 MountTabPercentage = 7.008 (or 700.8%) In the end, our math is saying the same thing, but I cannot stress enough how important it is that SpeedFromPosture is a flat number, while bonuses from vitality and mount items are percentages. Would it be easier to understand if the mount tab showed both the actual meters per second AND the percentage?
Yeah.. I caught that while I was cleaning up. The math was originally right in mine as well. It is just 1 am and I should be in bed, not breaking down equations. It would have been a lot easier if I managed to do it all in one post.. but alas.. the new forums don't like that editing thing. Kinda funny cause I pulled that part out of my post like 30 mins ago when I removed it for editing. The only really things messing with the movement speeds: The Horseshoes & Barding The KDQ bag buff and The Mounted/Unmounted player buff mods. *edit* When I swapped to the next post dealing with flight, I forgot the 1.0 portion for the mounted speed in my equation.. that was skewing everything off)
I think it is fine how it is. I merely took it as follows: Code: Speed = X * (1.0 + 3.20 + 0.50 + 0.10 ) * (1.0 + 0.1 + 0.15 + 0.20 + 0.01 ) Speed = X * 4.8 * 1.46 MountTabPercentage = X * 7.008 Where X = 5.55/5.55 * 100% X = 1 * 100% X = 100% Since I wasn't dealing with walking speed.